But this time it was someone that, for apparently ideological reasons, kept attacking me personally. Now I don't friend or unfriend at a whim, so this was a big deal for me.
Let me tell you the story...
There is a man, I'll call him Gordan, to protect his real identity. I had met him a few years ago to discuss the possibility of producing some video for an event he was arranging. Nothing came of it. Later he requested to be a friend on Facebook. No problem, as it is a great way to keep in touch with people and network.
I heard very little from Gordan until fairly recently, I would say over the last six months. He commented on a link I had posted to a story in the news. He obviously has very strong ideological opinions about things and his comment turned into a mini debate (although I hesitate to call it a debate). He made some sort of comment calling me radical and extreme. It became clear that he really didn't know what he was talking about. I asked if he had read the article that I had posted. He said, "No". I ask you, how can you debate something without having read what we are debating about. I let it go.
But the same thing happened on a few more occassions. Again, Gordan would comment on a link I had posted and start a debate without actually reading the article. I had been called extreme, radical and now Big Brother (BB). Although his definition of Big Brother is really bizarre.
Anyway this all culminated last night. I had posted a link to an article about the sad state of afairs at NASA. NASA, due to budget cuts is abandoning certain robotic Mars missions and is suffering in other areas as well. Now I believe that pushing the boundaries of science and exploration is an extremely important endeavor for the human race, and that is what NASA does very well, benefitting all of humanity.
Gordan commented on this post as well. Now I would be happy to debate the merits of science, of exploration, and of NASA. No problem. People are welcome to have different views. But as usual this thread of comments was far from a debate. It again was a bizarre personal attack on me and my views. It began with him commenting that if I think it is important then I should fund NASA. I told him that that was ridiculous. And that as a government agency, it does not accept donations.
This is what followed. I ask that anyone reading this let me know what they think of it. I like to think that I am a reasonable, rational person. In my view, Gordan, was rambling all over the place. I am curious to know if I am wrong or right on this. And so here is the conversation...
BEN
it is not bad to raise funds, but it is an important government organization that deserves to be properly funded
well, fund it then
the government is, they need to give it more
why
there is very little that is more important than expanding the frontiers of science
so fund it then
the government IS, they need to give it more
why dont you fund it with your own money if you believe so much in it
don't be a dumb ass (I admit this comment was out of frustration, but I was not calling him a dumb ass, just not to act like one)
What would you do?
Your calling me a dumb ass because I think you should give money to things that you believe in?
Obviously no individual can fund something like NASA
and by the way,, have I ever used that kind of language with you? Have I ever called you a dumb ass?So, what are you gonna do about it then if you believe in NASA?
Why not get others involved in Raising money for NASA if you believe in it so much
Ben, are you typing using only two fingers?
Well Ben, I can't wait for you to post.. Gotta Go. I do think that if you believe in somthing so much that you should help it financially. Its only fair to do that if you really believe in it.
You have accused me of being a radical, big brother, extreme etc.
And complaining about my typing.
There are certain government programs that are important. There are probably some that are important to you but have no meaning to me. Everyone benefits from science and exploration, and throughout the history of exploration, all of the big things have been done by government funding first.
And complaining about my typing.
There are certain government programs that are important. There are probably some that are important to you but have no meaning to me. Everyone benefits from science and exploration, and throughout the history of exploration, all of the big things have been done by government funding first.
I wish you wouldn't just talk in circles.
Its seems that you do type slow
By the way, if I had the money I would love to fund something like NASA
I am not talking in circles. I do know that big projects cost money. So, if you believe in a Big Project ,, then dont you think that you should help financially?
Well, your a smart person.. Raise some
If I was an American, I would be through my taxes
What did you give to NASA last year?
But your not American
Why should Americans Pay for it and not you?
You said its important for you
It is an American agency
So
It is important to the world
Well , Shoot them some of your money
I would if I had some. What the hell is your agenda?
Send them 1000 bucks then
Do you like to just provoke people?
I don't have the money
sent them 10 bucks then
you have 10 bucks dont you?
What is it that you want?
nothing ,, I just suggested that you put up some money to assist NASA if you believe in it so much your a bright man.. go make some money.. give some of it to NASA
And I said I would if I had it, and if there was a way to do so. They need more than the average person can donate. They need long term steady funding and that comes from the government.
Can you send them 10 bucks?
No
Nowhere to send it
Do you want me to find out where you should send your 10 bucks to in NASA?
I have an idea for you
No, you are just being silly. Do you not think that science, exploration and pushing the frontiers are important?
GORDAN
I have an idea for you
My home show is coming up.. I will give you a job at it for 2 days..
I will pay you 120 bucks a day
why dont you keep 120 and send 120 to NASA?
BEN
You hire me to produce a video for the home show, and if there is a place to donate to NASA, I will donate 20% to it.
GORDAN
Why dont you do it for Free?
Do one for NASA
BEN
Video is my business. I am not a charity. I need to eat.
GORDAN
well, I will pay you 240 for 2 days.. you will work for me at my home show. you keep 80 percent and give NASA 20 percent
BEN
I do video work.
Don't want to do anything else. (do you think I should accept a job from someone like this?)
GORDAN
Does that mean you cant do any other kind of work?
ohh, well then,, send NASA 1 dollar
you can afford a dollar no?
BEN
You should have a video to promote or at least archive the show.(I figured if he really wanted to hire me then at least he could hire me to produce a video)
GORDAN
why? I dont want one
are you telling me how I should spend my money for my show?
BEN
Oh god.(frustration) No.
GORDAN
I dont feel I need that,, I feel that I need a general laborour to work for 2 days.
you can do it.. I know you can
AND,, you can keep 80 percent,, and send NASA 20 percent
Ben,, I wont twist your arm.. either you will do it or youwont
BEN
No. And you didn't answer my previous question (as usual) (If I ever asked a question related to the original topic or a followup question, he would never answer)
GORDAN
Ben,, I cant take you seriously if you dont send money for things you believe in..
BEN
Avoidance again
GORDAN
(I had in previous conversations, asked him to define Big Brother or BB)
BB ' s are people who want to spend other peoples money.. to have other people put forth effort for things THEY believe in ,, all the while NOT giving anything of their own. ,, you havent even sent in one fucking dollar to this thing you believe in and your asking me if its important?,, That doesnt make any fucking sense to me. ... If I asked you to put in some money for somthing that I believed in and you asked me ,, what did I send it, ,and I said ,, ,nothing.. WTF.. not even a nickle?.. are you kidding?Your the one avoiding.. not me.. I give to the things I believe in.
I also dont ask others to put in money If I dont
I beleive that to be retarted
This is why I dont believe in you
If you just told me that you would send in 10 fucking bucks
but no.. you wont even do that?
but no.. you wont even do that?
not even a nickle
dont you think thats embarrasing
Be a Man,, gut it up, ,and assist what you believe in
fuck,, do somthing
BEN
You have no clue what I do or do not give money to. You can donate to things that accept donations. NASA doesn't as far as I know.
Some people don't have the money to donate to things.
GORDAN
what did you give money to this past year?
Well make some,, your bright
get off your ass,, I told you I would give you a job for 2 days so you could send in your 20 percent,, and you wont even do that
BEN
Why should I tell you. It is non of your business.
GORDAN
sure sure
BB
OK Ben,, Your a non performer
your wasting my time (I'm wasting his time?! Remember, he is the one that initiated this conversation)your all talk and no action
BEN
By the way Big Brother, refers to an overseeing government or entity that peers into all aspects of people lives and controls what they do.
You have no clue. (I am geting a little more than annoyed)
GORDAN
OK BEN,, here is one.. you come up with Twenty bucks,, I will match it,, THEN ,, we can both send it to NASA.. will you do that?
BEN
What is important to you?
GORDAN
me offering to match your twenty
thats important to me
do we have a deal
BEN
No. I will not be bullied into doing anything. That is big brother
GORDAN
bullied?
Your a slug
BEN
Really, what issues are important to you?
GORDAN
nite ben
I offered you a job
no
I asked you to send in 10 bucks
no
I offered to match you 20 bucks if you came up with it,, but you still say no
and I am a bully?
your a sllug
you gotta be kidding
I offered you 20 bucks for somthing that YOU believe in and you said no
because I asked you to match it
BEN
Listen, you take an issue and you turn it around into a personal attack that has nothing to do with the issue. It would be great to debate someone on the merits of an issue.
GORDAN
are you going to come up with 20 ?
waiting
BEN
No! Because the only reason to do so at this point is because you want me to. Are you willing to debate an actual issue?
GORDAN
I dont debate with people who have no skin in the game
BEN
You seemingly don't debate at all.
GORDAN
you put up 20,, I will match it,, then we can debate..
Ben,, your the one who says you believe in NASA
BEN
I really don't understand because you were the one to comment on my post.
GORDAN
so, no to the twenty then?
BEN
Then lets debate the merits of NASA
GORDAN
Ben,, tell all your friends this,, GORDAN offered to match your twenty bucks and both of us to send it to NASA.. GORDAN said,, he cant take you seriously that you believe in somthjing if you dont put in some money of your own,, on your own volition.
Ask them ,, If what I offered was fair.. more than fair.
Ask them ,, If what I offered was fair.. more than fair.
BEN
The offer was pointless. There is no way to donate to NASA.
GORDAN
nite BB
I immediately unfriended GORDAN
So there it is. I would really like some feedback. What would you have done? Was I unreasonable? Was I insulting?
